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Post by mm57553 on Jul 10, 2017 17:51:57 GMT
I'm asking this here because Traveler is the herb guru . I am currently on Ceftin and Doxy and a ton of supplements. I suspect I may have Babs based on some recent symptoms. I tested negative for all co-infections on DNA Connexions back in February (positive for 2 strains of Borrelia). I think the Babs may have just decided to come out and play once we started treating Bb. Rather than spend hundreds of dollars to test for it again, my doctor agreed to treat me for Babs based on symptoms. He wrote a script for Malarone. He also suggested I could go the herbal route instead using the CSA (Cryptolepis, Sida acuta, Alchornea) tincture that Buhner recommends. I went and ordered some from Woodland Essence. I filled the script for Malarone but haven't started taking it yet. I've been feeling pretty cr*ppy, and he wants me to get to feeling better before I start. I was pulsing Tinidazole, and he thinks that was causing me to feel so badly lately. Stopped that last week. I'm starting to feel a little better and will probably start the CSA next week and do that instead of the Malarone. My questions are, what should I expect? I am all about going slowly. I will literally start at one drop a day. My LLMD says to build up to 10 drops, three times a day (I weight 125 pounds, if that makes a difference). Will I herx like crazy? Do I just put a drop in a shot glass of water and down it? Not going to lie, a little nervous about starting anything new. I already detox like it's my job and eat a super-clean Paleo diet. Thanks for any help or word of wisdom.
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Post by Admin/ Traveler on Jul 10, 2017 18:44:40 GMT
LOL, MM! Thank you for your confidence in me! But, I don't know it all. Hopefully those that have used the combination tincture will be on soon to help you with more suggestions.
Some do herx pretty strongly on the CSA mix, some don't. With you saying that your symptoms are fairly strong though, I would suggest that you expect (ugh) to herx and take it slowly, keeping up on your detox carefully to help you through.
Put one drop of the CSA into a small glass (I like using shot glasses for this), and add a small amount of water. Most herbal tinctures don't taste really wonderful, and because they are made with alcohol usually, this can burn the sensitive tissues of the mouth/tongue, so it's best to mix it with a swallow of water or juice. Buhner suggests pomegranate juice, and I have found that pomegranate/cranberry juice will usually cover most herbs tastes - if it's swallowed quickly. LOL.
If you find that even one drop is too strong, you can thoroughly mix one drop of tincture with an easily divided amount of water (like one ounce), pour half into another jar with a tight fitting lid and set that half aside to take at your next dose - then take the other half. This will give you approximately 1/2 drop dose.
Best of luck and please do let us know how you are doing!!!
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Post by julymorning on Jul 10, 2017 18:46:26 GMT
I tried to answer, good that you're doing the 1 drop build up dosing, mm.
Yes, you can take it in a bit of water. You may not herx at all on the CSA, some will after the first drop, or 3,4,5 days later. It mostly depends on the condition your natural inner de-toxing paths are working, so be sure to help them along with the usual aids that you are probably familiar with...
Going to try to post now, the board has been refusing to cooperate with me today.
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Post by Randy on Jul 10, 2017 18:47:59 GMT
In my opinion, your herxin is based on you and how you react. Its different for everyone. Starting at 1 drop is a very good idea. I do the shot glass thing with my herbs also. I remember when I started the Sida+ and IHA from Woodland, I just dipped the dropper in the jar and then put it in the shot glass with water the first 2 days lol. Also another thing to keep in mind, and I always stress this, recommended dosing is never a requirement. SO many folks feel obligated to get to so many drops a day or they wont heal. Thats not always the case. Many people heal on lesser dosing. Also recommended dosing is never for sick people,its illegal to advise a certain amount of something to be used to address an illness. I know buhner dose however thats from his exp with patients and should never been interpreted as gospel. Listen to your own body go at your own pace. I learned this lesson the hard way as have other folks, trying to hit "normal" dosing to fast. Also, I was very nervous starting every herb Ive tried. But I knew if I didnt it was a guarantee I would get worse, so what did I have to lose.
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Post by Admin/ Traveler on Jul 10, 2017 18:49:50 GMT
All very good points made!! Thank you all!!
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Post by mm57553 on Jul 10, 2017 20:33:06 GMT
Thanks, everyone. Like I said, I'm going to wait until next week to start. My kiddos will be spending the week at Camp Grammy's (hanging out with their grandparents), so if I Herx, I won't have any obligations other than laying in bed LOL.
I also kind of remember reading that the CSA tincture can hit Bart too. Is that true? Don't know if I have that, but it sure would be convenient to hit both just in case I do. Does anyone know if that's true?
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Post by julymorning on Jul 10, 2017 21:10:51 GMT
I see now why I had initially gotten a message on here that it was unable to post my reply and to try again later. (I opened a second window and tried again.) Looks like 3 of us were trying to post at the same time.
The sida acuta treats Bart, per SHB: "If you have bartonella, then you will have to treat it as well as the lyme. The best easy protocol for bartonella is: Sida acuta tincture ¼ tsp 3x day for 30 days Hawthorn tincture, same Japanese knotweed, (tincture, same dose as above, or capsules, 2 capsules 3x daily) ECGC 400mg +- daily Houttuyina If powder form, 1 tbl daily L-arginine 5000 mg daily in divided doses Milk thistle seed, standardized, 1200 mg daily All for 30 days."
I removed the suppliers he recommended but can easily be found on his site where he answers questions.
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Post by julymorning on Jul 10, 2017 21:29:23 GMT
I came back on to add this disclaimer from Buhner: "If you have active herpes, chicken pox, or shingles DO NOT USE L-arginine." And to say I figured I would just list his whole basic bart protocol so you know.
But in your original question you said suspected Babs, so is Babesia what you're hoping to hit with the CSA too, or you suspect Bartonella also? Just wanting to clarify. There is so much overlap in all the infections and what many of the tinctures will hit.
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Post by girlie on Jul 10, 2017 22:16:17 GMT
Buhner's Basic Protocol for bart also includes:
Isatis/houttuynia/alchornea combination.
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Post by mm57553 on Jul 10, 2017 22:54:34 GMT
I came back on to add this disclaimer from Buhner: "If you have active herpes, chicken pox, or shingles DO NOT USE L-arginine." And to say I figured I would just list his whole basic bart protocol so you know. But in your original question you said suspected Babs, so is Babesia what you're hoping to hit with the CSA too, or you suspect Bartonella also? Just wanting to clarify. There is so much overlap in all the infections and what many of the tinctures will hit. I suspect Babs, which is what I'm hoping to hit with the CSA. I don't know or really think I have bart, but who knows? Just thought it would be handy to hit that too, just in case. I will do the CSA for a while, in addition to the abx for Bb, and see how it goes. It seems like I was doing a lot better, then I started crashing again. My LLMD seems to think it was the Tinidazole kicking my behind, and I know that was part of it. But this time around I was getting symptoms I hadn't really had before that seemed to line up with Babs. So we're giving this a try. Thanks, everyone for the help.
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Post by Randy on Jul 11, 2017 19:28:00 GMT
One other thing to keep in mind is, some infections are suppressed until others are hit. Then those infection symptoms come out even more. Its truly maddening.
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